Dialogue Is Not Cozy

In Oslo, we were invited to dinner by Reverend Sunniva Gyler. Sunniva studied at Wartburg in the mid-1990’s, and is a prominent pastor in Norway.  She describes herself as socially liberal and theologically orthodox.  Pastor Sunniva also invited Mr. Mehtab Afsar, the General Secretary of the Islamic Council of Norway, and Za’im, board member of the Council. Sunniva and Mehtab have been engaged in interfaith dialogue for years. We were privileged to get to hear them describe their relationship and work.

Pastor Sunniva spent years serving as a pastor on the east side of Oslo, an eclectic part of the city, where shops, mosques, taverns, and churches stand shoulder to shoulder. In one of the most expensive cities in the world, eastern Oslo is the most affordable place to live in town.  Sunniva described that she first got to know her Muslims neighbors when they were united by the common goal of forming a neighborhood watch group. 

Over the years, relationships between the groups grew.  Sunniva, Mehtab, and others have been engaged in Christian-Muslim dialogue and have done the painstaking work of crafting joint statements together. The work has not been easy. Sunniva and Metrab were quick to say that dialogue is not cozy. 

Sunniva pointed out that one challenge is that typically it’s Christians who are socially liberal who interested in interfaith dialogue, but Muslims who are interested in speaking are socially conservative.

Both shared with us that one of the most difficult things is dealing with people in one’s own tradition, intra-religious dialogue.   Sunniva shared that other Christians are most critical of her work with Muslims. Mehtab spoke about getting roughed up by prominent Musilim extremists. “But at least we are talking,” he added with a smile. 

Pastor Sunniva shared that building interfaith relationships can happen on two levels: one, more superficial and safe than the other. She recommended hosting events that require little vulnerability, like inviting folks to come together for a brief coffee, or to an activity that involves doing something together so that people can just meet each other. Over time, friendships form. She spoke of her group of Christian and Muslim women who regularly go on retreat together. In December they gathered to make gingerbread. Together they created a mosque and and a creche. 

For people who are committed to deeper understand of each other, Sunniva and Mehtab recommend meeting in smaller groups to begin discussion, starting with common values. It is in these smaller groups, over time, and lots of coffee and cake, that dialogue happens. 

The relationship between Sunniva and Mehtrab and others has not watered down their commitment to their own traditions, but has strengthened their own identities as Muslim and Christian. Over and over, Wartburg professor Dr. Priebe has taught me that people of other faiths want and expect me to be Christian, to speak about Jesus and what Jesus has to do with them.  In our politeness, or our attempt to preempt the thought that we share the judgmental practices of our fundamentalist Christian brothers and sisters, we Lutherans dance around our faith. The topic ofJesus Christ is sometimes conspicuously absent in our interfaith conversations. It was compelling and convicting to hear Pastor Sunniva speak of her faith unapologetically while also committed to dialogue with her Muslim brothers and sisters. 

Sunniva and Mehtab disagree a lot, and they are friends.  “I know what he thinks on a subject. I know we disagree. But I know him.” It’s the relationship, not the agreeing, that they are after.